Brief summary
The Trump administration is facing pressure from major companies like Walmart, Target, and Home Depot, who have privately warned the president that his trade war with China will lead to price increases and empty store shelves within two weeks. This has prompted a shift in rhetoric from the White House, with Treasury Secretary Besson and President Trump himself suggesting a de-escalation of the trade conflict may be coming. However, uncertainty remains as the administration has yet to announce any concrete trade deals, and the president’s unpredictable policy shifts have eroded confidence in the U.S. economy both domestically and globally. Meanwhile, the fallout from Trump’s trade wars and attacks on institutions like the Federal Reserve and universities are being felt across various sectors, raising concerns about the broader impact on American businesses and consumers.
Main body
00:00:00
While the markets are reacting to yesterday’s comments from President Trump and members of his administration, Treasury Secretary Scott Besson told investors in a closed-door meeting the president’s trade war with China is, quote, not sustainable. According to a person in the room, Besson said he expects there will be a de-escalation in the very near future, but acknowledged negotiating with China is likely to be a slog. Later in the day, White House Press Secretary Caroline Leavitt echoed the Treasury Secretary’s optimism. Adding the administration was setting the stage for a deal, although neither official suggested those negotiations actually have even begun. President Trump was asked about trade talks yesterday at the White House.
00:00:42
I’m not going to say, oh, I’m going to play hardball with China. I’m going to play hardball with you, President Xi. No, no, we’re going to be very nice. They’re going to be very nice and we’ll see what happens. But ultimately, they have to make a deal. One hundred and forty-five percent is very high. And it won’t be that high. It’s not going to be that high. It’ll come down substantially, but it won’t be zero. It used to be zero. We were just destroyed. China was taking us for a ride, and it’s not going to happen. We’re going to be very good to China.
00:01:15
The President also walked back his attacks in part on Jerome Powell, the Fed Chair, days after posting online that Powell’s termination can’t come soon enough, in the words of the President there yesterday. Trump said he never was actually going to fire Powell, none whatsoever, uh, never did.
00:01:34
The press runs away with things now. I have no intention of firing him; I would like to see him be a little more active in terms of his idea to lower interest rates. This is a perfect time to lower interest rates. If he doesn’t, is it the end? No, it’s not. But it would be good timing. It could have taken place earlier. But no, I have no intention to fire him.
00:01:59
So meanwhile, the White House says more than a dozen countries have brought the administration written trade proposals and several foreign leaders are setting meetings this week to discuss potential deals.
00:02:13
Spoke to our entire trade team this morning. There is a lot of progress being made. We now have 18 proposals on paper that have been brought to the trade team. Again, these are proposals on paper that countries have proposed to the Trump administration and to our government. You have Secretary Besant, Secretary Lutnick, Ambassador Greer, NEC Director Hassett, and Peter Navarro, the entire trade team, meeting with 34 countries this week alone. We’re doing very well in respect to a potential trade deal with China. As I mentioned, there have now been 18 proposals in more than 100 countries around the world who are wanting to make a deal with the United States of America. And the president and the administration are setting the stage for a deal with China.
00:02:55
So while questions still remain on negotiations with China, the White House is reportedly close to general trade agreements with Japan and India. The details of the trade deals are still being worked out. According to Politico, the agreements are closer to memorandums of understanding or a broad architecture for future deals. Jim Vande Hei, you guys are writing about what’s happening behind the scenes and what sort of led to this moment here, saying that President Trump got a scare from CEOs and the markets on Monday. What has led to what we’re seeing today?
00:03:35
Yeah, I think the important takeaway would be in the last 24 hours, I’d say for the first time, we feel like, talking to White House officials, they’re starting to make progress in persuading Trump that what he did early on was too dangerous and is really having ramifications that go beyond what he was seeing in his line of sight. Very important meeting yesterday in the White House. You had the CEOs of Walmart, Target, Home Depot with the president warning him very bluntly saying, ‘Listen, like you’re going to have price increases soon. You’re going to have empty shelves in a lot of our stores.
00:04:07
Like in two weeks.
00:04:08
Like in two weeks. And you’re going to have smaller companies going under because they’re so reliant on trade. And that hasn’t shown up yet at the stores, but it will soon. And I think the combination of that, watching the markets.’ Hearing from other CEOs across different sectors saying the same thing does appear. And I put quotes around ‘appear’ because the President really is dug in on on tariffs as a theory. But but at least the White House officials who are trying to persuade him are. And that is an important thing to note about Trump. Like if someone who runs a company is a CEO, you need people around you who will look at you and say, ‘you know what, that’s a dumb idea’ and say it bluntly or ‘that’s a dangerous idea’ and say it bluntly. He doesn’t have that. So when you’re trying. To persuade him, people have to either bring in other officials that he respects or they have to say, ‘No, no, sir, this is actually a genius idea if you move it this way.’ And so the process of moving him is taking a lot longer than those who don’t like the policy internally would hope. So we’ll see if he continues on this track. But certainly the comment on China, certainly the comment on Powell, the idea that that was the media making it up that he wanted to fire him. They were reacting to his social media posts where he basically called him a dog and said that he’s a loser and shouldn’t be in the gig. Like, is he saying he should be fired? No. But anyone else interpreting that might have might be fair to interpret it as that way.
00:05:29
Well, yeah, I mean, Trump said, quote, on Friday in a true social post, Powell’s termination cannot come soon enough. That’s pretty explicit. He also called him a loser a couple of days ago. But, John, what are you hearing about the turn here from a little bit of a turn in rhetoric, at least from the president about Powell yesterday, about China? Obviously, the markets have tanked because of these tariffs. They tanked even more when he started threatening the job of Jerome Powell. Someone got to him maybe just for a moment. As always, it might just be a day and he’ll be back at his attacks today. But someone perhaps communicating to him, as Jim suggests, CEOs, people he respects, rich guys saying, ‘This is not working.’ You got to pump the brakes.
00:06:11
A hallmark of Trump’s first term were these warring factions in the building. And this time around, they really tried to say that’s not the case. We’re all using our oars, rowing in the same direction. But we have seen a real split here in the last couple of weeks. And what’s happened is that Scott Pensey, the Treasury Secretary, is a little more emboldened than he was back on Liberation Day three weeks ago. And Peter Navarro has been pushed aside somewhat. There’s been including one key meeting last week where Trump announced his pause on tariffs. It happened because Navarro was literally on the other side of the building and other aides rushed to Trump and got a few moments with him. And the president still remains responsive to who’s in his ear last. And that’s what we saw a little bit yesterday. It’s Bessette and his team. Also, as Jim notes, some CEOs warning him that the damage here is real. You can’t be threatening to fire the head of the Fed. Let’s be clear. He did. And you can’t. You know, the idea of a trade war with China is going to continue to sink the markets here. And Monday was a really rough day. We saw this rhetoric yesterday that, at least momentarily, gives a respite to Wall Street. But, Kathy, I want to go to you on this because. This is what we all know it; we say it a lot, you know? The markets and also for other nations looking to deal with the United States, looking to have trade with the United States – what do they bank on? They want predictability; they want certainty; they want you know there’s some sort of census that we know where this is going. Even on a day when yes, the markets cheered what Trump did it’s another 180; it’s a constant shifting of stances of language and it’s just so hard for any other nation to get their arms around it. And yes, I think at best we can say loose understanding of frameworks to deals it’s gonna be hard to fill in those blanks.
00:07:54
Yeah, and the question now is: is the message we’ve had from the last 25/ 24 hours from Scott Besant and from the President himself about Jerome Powell? The end of the story. Is that the decision now going forward? It’s no longer going to be the roller coaster, but the strategy has been set. Powell is not going to be fired; the Fed is going to maintain its independence; the tariff war is going to come down and a normal service – if you like – will be resumed. We don’t know that yet. Trump seems to be more receptive to markets today than he was three weeks ago when he initially announced liberation. Day. Scott Bessette is going to be speaking at the International Monetary Fund later today for their spring meetings. And it’s interesting that this is a kind of time where the international community has come to Washington. I was speaking to an IMF official a couple of days ago who said there’s two real problems with how the world is seeing the White House at the moment, the world of financiers is seeing the White House at the moment. One is the policy. They don’t like the policies of protectionism and these tariffs that are being put on countries around the world. But the second And the bigger problem is a question of competence. Is is this White House competent when it comes to stewardship, not just of the American economy, but of the global economy? And I was told that that second issue is the bigger concern that other countries have with America at the moment.
00:09:13
Speaking of the IMF, we’re looking at this headline right here from CNBC. IMF slashing 2025 U . S. growth forecast to one point eight percent. That’s down almost a full percentage point. for the projections internationally. Let’s bring in the anchor of CNBC’s Worldwide Exchange, Frank Holland. Frank, it sounds like based on what we’re talking about here, some of the leaked rhetoric that we’re hearing from Treasury Secretary Besant and from the president himself about not now wanting to fire Jerome Powell, that the futures are up a bit.
00:09:44
I mean, absolutely. Futures are considerably higher looking at the Nasdaq and the S&P in the pre-market, both of them up over 2%. So very clearly, a lot of optimism over a possible end to the trade war with China that’s impacted business and consumer confidence. The president’s saying he’s going to be, quote unquote, very nice, and he expects tariffs to come down substantially when it comes to that trade deal with China. Also, you mentioned Treasury Secretary Scott Besson also saying he sees a de-escalation. However, when kind of pressed on it, he says that they haven’t, the administration hasn’t really talked directly to China. However, this morning, China’s adding to the conversation, saying in part, in a translated statement, ‘The U. S. can’t say it wants to reach an agreement with China and, on the other hand, keep exerting extreme pressure.’ So that statement, again, coming from China today, translated. I guess it’s one step you could or one thing you could say is positive that there’s a dialogue. I talked to a lot of trade officials. They say as long as there’s a dialogue, it’s positive. When there isn’t any conversation, it isn’t positive. But the very latest from China. And then, as you mentioned, President Trump saying he doesn’t want to fire Jay Powell. We saw the market sell off on Monday on some critical comments about the Federal Reserve chair urging him to lower rates. Also, the president getting a bit personal with Jerome Powell. Remember that Fed decisions coming up on May 7th. So the market’s just kind of breathing a sigh of relief that that pressure on Jerome Powell seems to be going away at least for now. And that potentially there could be a trade deal on the way. So you mentioned the futures are higher again. S&P and the Nasdaq, both of them up over 2% in the pre-market. A number of factors. Again, the president, no plans to fire Jay Powell. China trade deal. Hopes also that Tesla shares will continue to move higher. We’re going to talk a bit more about Tesla. I know you guys want to talk about it. But CEO Elon Musk saying he’s going to reduce his time working with Doge and focus more on Tesla. Tesla, a big part of the markets for both the S&P and the Nasdaq. A lot of waiting there. So, that’s those shares moving up about six percent higher, giving the markets a boost as well. One other thing to watch this morning, Apple and Meta, both of them fined by the EU today under the Digital Markets Act, about 500 million euros for Apple, about 200 million euros for a Meta. The President has said in the past that he would possibly put tariffs on countries that penalize U. S. companies. So, again, something to watch. On my show earlier today, we spoke to a U. S. trade official. He said the trade bloc is looking to Asia to make some deals as it continues to de-risk from China, as opposed to decouple from China. A lot of reports say that the White House wants the EU to decouple from China. That trade official we talked to said that’s not really an option and it’s still looking to make a deal with the U. S.
00:12:07
Is President Trump on defense over the plunging and volatile economy? This story keeps kicking. America’s largest companies are down, all of them in the market since the Trump tariff war began. It’s a swift toll that we’ve seen first on Wall Street. Trillions wiped out in days. But it is heading for Main Street, and I’m going to show you why tonight. Because we’re seeing new indications from big box stores to malls, and we know it’s coming for Main Street for a few reasons. I always try to give you the The evidence that shows you why we know what we think we know. And here it is. First, there’s detailed data on the inventories and supply chains. So it shows when American stores will be running out of these products, many of which have some foreign ingredient in them. And they’re running out of what was purchased before the tariff war began. Second, some of America’s largest companies track all of this. Because it’s their whole business and expertise. This is what they do, so they’re all over it. And they are now formally warning about the coming Trump slump any way they can, which includes what I’m about to show you, the largest employer in America, Walmart, which has over a million and a half employees. They employ more Americans than any other company. And the Walmart chief just joined an attempted Trump tariff intervention. Along with the CEOs of the other huge retailers, Target and Home Depot, to privately warn Trump that his tariffs, let’s take this in full, I want people to be able to see this, his tariffs, you can read along, the tariff and trade policy will not only disrupt supply chains and raise prices, it will lead to empty shelves. Now that’s big. If people were upset over, say, high prices during the inflation years that we had, imagine high prices and basic products also being wiped out, echoing the empty shelf panic of the pandemic that we all remember in Trump’s first term. Well, empty shelves are an unpopular outcome. It impacts people’s lives, their ability to plan. You end up having to go other places, spend more gas money. You know the drill. It will also, obviously, if it happens again, impact Trump’s political approval. Now, when could these empty shelves hit? The disruptions could land. Again, let’s see the whole thing. The Trump disruptions could become noticeable in two weeks. I’ll just tell you at home, I want that big on your screen because it’s one of those little sets of words that will matter a lot if it happens in two weeks. Today, it’s in Axios. Today, it’s on, of course, television news covering the markets or the economy or the politics. But a heck of a lot more Americans are going to notice if in two weeks from tonight, their shelves are bare at all the Walmarts around the country. It’s sobering. It’s also foreseeable, based on what so many economists and conservative allies have been telling the White House. Sobering for a Trump administration that keeps trying to claim that trillions lost in the trade war are just temporary pain, but it will lead, soon enough, they have said, to better results, which certainly means something other than COVID-style empty shelves. Now, the warning I just mentioned, this private meeting with the president, is the runway for Trump edging back to a pattern that he’s repeated. Trump is a self-proclaimed trade warrior who often breaks Tom Petty’s first law, don’t back down. And also, by the way, Sun Tzu’s teaching that the true warrior only fights battles he’s already won, which simply means you assess the opponent and resources first so that you don’t pick losing battles. That would be a different approach, say, than firing off economic shots at China, if it’s in a battle you can’t ultimately win, one that even your own team has been admitting is a set of unsustainable tariffs. So that is the runway for this Trump-induced whiplash hitting Wall Street right now. Investors eyeing what they call the Trump tax on these tariffs, and now the Trump cost of uncertainty, while hoping the president will end the back-and-forth once and for all, and finally, maybe, just cave. This make-or-break hour begins with the ongoing market volatility taking investors on yet another ride today. It’s been a really rough road.
00:16:29
There’s been so much volatility, Adam. And I think that investors are tired. Like Ryan says, they want clarity.
00:16:36
It doesn’t get rid of the volatility. Some days up a thousand, some days down a thousand, depending on what’s coming out of the White House. How are you feeling today?
00:16:44
I feel like I need a neck brace. The volatility has been insane.
00:16:50
Insane volatility. Now, every economy faces some inevitable volatility, but these experts, many of whom, by the way, lean towards conservative views on policy, see Trump as the cause of this avoidable volatility. Fox News’ sister outlet, The Wall Street Journal, has declared Trump’s tariffs now the greatest economic threat. It’s a bad report card for the first 100 days. Over on actual Fox TV, where they first downplayed the market’s plunge, they avoided even showing a stock ticker on those big crash days. Well, now there are more voices saying trade wars are bad and the administration’s briefings are straining credibility.
00:17:31
Trade wars don’t have a lot of history of working out very well for any party who’s involved in it.
00:17:37
If you come up every other day, yeah, we just had a great call with so-and-so and these guys, and it starts to take away credibility. It starts to smack of desperation.
00:17:48
Credibility fading. Desperation coming out of the White House. And I can remind you some of the other indications we’ve heard. Peter Navarro, the trade advisor, and others said they had dozens of deals, up to 90 deals in the works. If that were true, you would expect some of those deals to be announced, especially from such a PR-focused administration. We’re still at zero. No announced deals. What we are announcing, what we are covering, what we are hearing is this talk of unsustainability or people around Trump basically trying to give the markets some sort of cold comfort, some sort of hope was the word of the day yesterday. I showed you that in headlines if you happen to. Catch the news last night. And then these leaks and these indications that Trump will eventually back down, almost trying to will him towards the reality that the markets say is needed, that Walmart says he has about two weeks left to decide on, or we get empty shelves. Here’s a quote. Tariffs could come down to between 50 and 65 percent. That would be slashing Trump’s big China tariffs to, quote, de-escalate a trade war that has not gotten. The United States or the administration anything so far. That’s the Wall Street Journal quoting a White House official. Politico, referring to Trump’s past explanation when he backed down partially and saying another case of the yips taken together. It marks Trump’s biggest economic climbdown since the last one. Another indication of just how badly most of this stuff is landing. You can remember Trump did retreat on the reciprocal tariffs. Camouflaging that in a 90-day pause, and backed down on his attacks against the Fed chair. They were beefing only because the Fed chair had made accurate points about the cost of tariffs. So there has been some retreating, but many of the key tariffs are still in place. There are no trade deals yet announced. And because this is starting as a market story, as I’m telling you tonight, we are, according to the big box retailers, two weeks away from it being a story that everyone’s going to wake up to in a very very literal way in their grocery stores, in their malls, in their big box stores. But right now, we’re hearing more from the market folks who catch this stuff first. Here’s a billionaire investor, Ken Griffin. And he says what Trump is doing has tarnished the American brand.
00:20:11
The American brand, right? The United States was more than just a nation. It’s a brand. It’s a universal brand, whether it’s our culture, our financial strength, our military strength. America rose beyond just being a country. It was like an aspiration for most of the world. And we’re eroding that brand right now.
00:20:34
There’s another brand here, which involves, of course, the business billionaire, richest guy in the world, who’s been tasked to do so much for the Trump administration, Elon Musk. And that’s also eroding. We’ve seen a real backlash as people have started to understand how he is trying to do his version of pseudo-governing. You can only call it pseudo because he didn’t commit to what others do in giving up business interests or devoting himself to the public interest. He wants to do both. He wants to run his companies and parachute into different agencies and make big sweeping changes. So how’s that going? Well, the new polling shows 47% of Americans view Tesla negatively compared to only about a quarter positive. Half have a negative view of Musk, much, much higher negatives than positives. And Musk’s power has been clipped a little, we were told, in a cabinet meeting that leaked in The Times that Trump was pulling him back from some roles. Today, NBC reporting, Musk got into a shouting match with the Treasury Secretary in the White House recently, clashing over who would really call the shots at the IRS. Musk has said he’s going to reduce his role in this kind of work. And Tesla has seen a 70% drop in sales. And its overall market value, I showed you the top 500 companies down, say, about 12%. Well, Tesla’s faring worse. Down 41% means about half of the entire stock’s value, the company value, has been wiped out since inauguration. Many investors and analysts say, partly related to Musk trying to do it all, but not doing any job particularly well. Many Americans voting with their wallets. They say they will never buy Teslas again, and it is a consumer-facing product. We’re seeing related anger at the town halls.
00:22:24
My concern right now, and I think I speak for a lot of Americans, is Elon Musk.
00:22:31
I’m worried about the power that Elon Musk has been given without any kind of election. Are you willing to use your subpoena power to say, ‘Musk? Come in here, stand in front of Congress and answer some hard questions.’ Are you going to subpoena him at some point?
00:22:45
Elon Musk and Doge have been authorized by the president of the United States.
00:22:52
Can we count on you to go back to Washington and demand immediate oversight into Doge and Elon Musk?
00:23:06
We do have an Internet where people can find just about anything really fast. We have news. We have television news. You have YouTube. Right. But it still takes time for big things to sink in. Sometimes people come up to me and they ask, does anyone care? Is anyone upset? Is this all just OK with people? Well, I just showed you in data of the whole country and in examples in the town halls. And in all the other indications we have, no, it’s not OK with people. There was a close election. They promised to do certain things. Among those promises were get prices under control and just help the economy go boom. Well, it went boom in a very different way, boom to bust. And now this is sinking in, and we’re still weeks away from the very, very real crescendo that you could see in stores if, according to Walmart and other big, again, conservative-leaning institutions, unless Trump backs down further on the tariffs.
00:24:03
And joining us now, NBC News Chief Washington Foreign Affairs Correspondent Andrea Mitchell and the former Commanding General of the U. S. Army Europe, Retired Lieutenant General Ben Hodges. Andrea, let’s begin right with the breaking news. The President of the United States has just spoken about Zelensky.
00:24:20
Well, he’s just posted on Truth Social. And certainly one of the reasons I was coming on to talk to you about this and one of the reasons we wanted to talk together, Jose, is that that was a real tell from J. D. Vance that they are putting pressure on Zelensky to accept this, frankly, very one-sided proposal that the U. S. made last week. And European leaders have been saying, and certainly Zelensky has been saying, Zelensky wanted to, well, did accept the 30-day ceasefire. Russia only accepted a one-day, 30-hour Easter ceasefire, not the 30-day ceasefire. But the U.S. proposal was for, basically, Russia to be able to keep Crimea, which it took in 2014, and also NATO would never be an option for Ukraine. Well, the president has just joined in and really upped the ante by saying Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky is boasting on the front page of The Wall Street Journal that Ukraine will not legally recognize the occupation of Crimea. There’s nothing to talk about here. This statement is very harmful to the peace negotiations with Russia, and that Crimea was lost years ago under the auspices of President Barack Hussein Obama. This is, of course. the the language used you know on truth social by the by president trump which is to demean both president obama and Zelensky. He says that is not even a point of discussion. Nobody is asking Zelensky to recognize Crimea as Russian territory. But if he wants Crimea, why didn’t they fight for it 11 years ago when it was handed over to Russia without a shot being fired? The area also houses for many years before the Obama handover major Russian submarine bases. It’s inflammatory statements like Zelensky’s that makes it so difficult to settle this war. He has nothing to boast about. The situation for Ukraine is dire. He can have peace or he can fight for another three years before losing the whole country. I have nothing to do with Russia, but have much to do with wanting to save on average 5,000 Russian and Ukrainian soldiers a week who are dying for no reason whatsoever. The statement made by Zelensky today will do nothing but prolong the killing field. Nobody wants that. We are very close to a deal, but the man with no cards to play should now finally, ALL CAPS, get it done. I look forward to being able to help Ukraine and Russia get out of this complete and total mess, ALL CAPS, that would have never started if I were president. This is basically throwing down the gauntlet. To Ukraine and it is a post that mirrors what happened in the Oval Office last month; it is putting all of the pressure on Ukraine when Ukraine has accepted a 30-day ceasefire, Russia has not, and saying that, yes, Crimea – that territory does stay under Russian control. It’s a very one-sided, one-sided negotiation, and Zelenskiy is potentially going to face the kind of repercussions he faced last time a month ago, which was the cutoff of intelligence and military aid and a tremendous setback, especially the air defenses that only the U. S. and not Europe can provide. I think I’m really eager to hear what the Lieutenant General has to say, General Hodges. But from a diplomatic perspective, and from what I know about Ukraine and having covered all of this for years, this is a real turning point.
00:27:35
And, Andrea, I wonder if I could just stay with you a little bit longer. We’ll, of course, speak with the general in just a minute. But so the president’s reaction was very clear. And then add to this what the vice president said. Add to this these negotiations or meetings that were canceled at the highest level. We don’t know how far down. You know these meetings were were cancelled but, but in the art of diplomacy, uh, Andrea, which you know better than anyone, you know holding meetings with warring sides is in and of itself a statement or a message. Cancelling meetings with the two sides or in this case one of the two sides is also a very powerful statement and message.
00:28:29
Absolutely. You got it right. Because, you know, the Ukrainians are in London, available to meet. You know, Keith Kellogg from the United States is there, but not Steve Witkoff, not the U. S. Secretary of State. And Witkoff is going on for what will be his fourth meeting with Vladimir Putin, according to Russian officials. This is all very lopsided. And as you can see from this social post from the President, it is all on Zelensky, blaming Zelensky for the war when he was invaded.
00:29:06
And Lieutenant General, so let’s talk about that, because the blame towards Zelensky is something that seems to be one of the most favored things that the administration from the President to the Vice President on down enjoys doing. This whole issue of Crimea, Crimea, Lieutenant General, why is Zelensky so clear on the situation in Crimea? And I’m thinking in 2014, when it was illegally taken by Russia, even though the world did react and the world did oppose it in a de facto way, nothing was really done.
00:29:51
So, thanks, Jose. First of all, it’s seeing Secretary of State Rubio, the Vice President and the President all scrambling away from this disaster that they created as fast as they can. You know, they’re washing their hands of it. Remember, the President said 24 hours were at the three-month mark, and now they’re tired and they’re giving up and walking away. That’s probably the best thing that could happen to Ukraine is to get the this administration out of it. This is the approach by the administration was doomed from the start because they either never understood or never cared about the history of the geography or what’s going on here. To say when the President says the Ukrainians are fighting for no apparent reason, they’re fighting for their survival against a country that invaded them. How can the President of the United States say that a democratic country is fighting for its survival is fighting for nothing? And Andrea is exactly right. I mean, from the beginning, this has been 100% pro-Russia. The fact that Mr. Wyckoff uses Kremlin talking points better than Lavrov is all that we need to understand. Now, what’s also missing in the American calculation here, and I think part of the reason that President Zelensky is standing firm, not only on the fact that this is the sovereignty of his country, but it’s also the fact that Ukraine, according to General Cavoli, the Supreme Allied Commander, in his testimony to the House and Senate Armed Services Committee three weeks ago, Ukraine is actually winning on the battlefield. This war has been going on 11 years, including four years of the last Trump administration. And Russia has no way of knocking Ukraine out of the war. So Russia would never live up to any ceasefire. And there’s no way there’s going to be a negotiation unless there’s a ceasefire with a force to compel Russian compliance. So I think President Zelensky sees he actually is in a pretty strong position. And I think the Europeans also realize that. It’s in their interest that they help Ukraine. Otherwise, they’ll be dealing with the consequences.
00:31:58
But Lieutenant General, there is a stalemate in the battlefield and that stalemate hasn’t been moving much. What leads you to have any optimism that just on the military side, Ukraine can continue with the status quo without massive U. S. support? Intelligence, military. Where do you find the optimism there?
00:32:27
Well, the map that you just showed earlier is a very good map. That’s what the battlefield looks like after 11 years of fighting with Russia having every advantage. That’s all that they’ve been able to get. And frankly, American support has dropped off to almost zero in the last several months, including intelligence support. So Ukraine is achieving this without strong American support. And to be candid, the Biden administration failed miserably to actually try and help Ukraine win. They never even said we want Ukraine to win. So the support from the U. S. has always been underwhelming and inadequate. The key is, can Europe step up and other countries? I mean, Japan just said that they’re willing to help provide some of the long-range intelligence that would be required to help Ukraine. To fill some of the gap that the U. S. is going to leave. Look, the Ukrainians, they’re fighting for the survival of their country. Vladimir Putin never, ever has stepped away from his stated objective of destroying Ukraine as a state or the idea of Ukraine as a state. Ukrainians understand this. They see that. It’s our arrogance that prevented us from fully understanding that.
00:33:41
Joining us now, Democratic Governor Maura Healey of Massachusetts. She’s a graduate of Harvard, co-captain of the Crimson women’s basketball team, and is here to talk about this and a couple of other things. I really want to talk about what you guys are doing to help businesses dealing with tariff problems. But first, let’s talk about Harvard. You actually have this post that you put up. Donald Trump’s cuts to universities and hospitals mean scientists are being laid off and shutting down. Life-saving research. It’s bad for patients, bad for science and bad for our economy. Give me a sense of your reaction to what is happening at not just Harvard, but beyond.
00:34:27
Well, this is bigger than Harvard and I stand with Harvard. I support what they are doing, it is very very important that Harvard file that suit and stand up to the bully that Trump is. But let me tell you how it’s playing out, because it’s not just at Harvard. It’s attacks on colleges and universities, on research institutions across Massachusetts, across this country. And here are the consequences right now. So already, I was on the campus of UMass Medical just last week. Because of Donald Trump’s cuts, they’ve had to lay off 200 faculty members. They’ve had to rescind offers to 80 graduate students. Mika, these are scientists, okay? These are people who are discovering and working on life-saving cures for cancer, Alzheimer’s, ALS, you name it. And all of that is being shut down. Here’s what also is happening, which Americans need to know. The ones benefiting from Donald Trump’s misguided attacks on our universities and on research are benefiting China. China is recruiting right now on our campuses all those scientists and faculty members and students who’ve been laid off or had their offers rescinded and say, come to China. We’ll build you that lab. We’ll give you staff. So for a president who is about America first, he’s making America last. He’s making us weaker. He’s making us less competitive. And it breaks my heart. It breaks my heart to know that patients will suffer. They’re already suffering, Mika, because we’ve had clinical trials shut down as a result of his dismantling of NIH funding. And that’s compounded now by his effort to attack universities. And compounded by the attacks on our foreign students, right? He’s scaring, for a guy who wants to reshore American talent, right? I mean, he is driving everyone, including American students and faculty members. Out of this country because they want to be able to do their research somewhere, so it’s a very dangerous situation, um totally, totally destabilizing and it’s really pointing America in the wrong direction.
00:36:37
It almost seems like self-sabotage, um, in a way when you look at all the different ways everything that this president is doing is actually sabotaging this country, losing scientists to China, losing students to other countries, losing all of the, well, all of the great, incredible things that we worked for years to build and develop and call home here in America, our intellectual drain. Now that is happening because of what’s happening with the students, with the universities, with hospitals, with science. Tell me, Governor, what is Massachusetts doing to fight back or at least help those who are impacted by such drastic cuts?
00:37:28
Well, we’re doing a few things in Massachusetts right now. We’re the number one state for education, health care and innovation. So we really take these matters seriously. We’re working hard right now with our universities, with our teaching hospitals, with our life science companies – where the global hub of life sciences to figure out ways to shore up some of this. Obviously, state funding doesn’t begin to make up the difference when the attacks are coming in this way from the federal administration. But we all have to work together. And I see that happening in our state. I also brought together recently a group of other businesses. You see, in a matter like this, we’ve got manufacturing all over this state that. Is about building the parts and the supplies that go into a lot of the research in our labs. So I’ve been working with them on how we can support them in this time. And in fact, can some of them manufacture some of the parts that our research institutions are having or have had to source from overseas that now with tariffs become prohibitively expensive? So that’s the kind of work we need to engage in. But it is challenging as a governor who cut taxes, as a governor who’s building housing. You know, it is so disruptive that we have these tariffs where now my lumber is coming from Canada and the gypsum and other materials are coming from Mexico. And Trump just made housing a lot more expensive to build. And again, it’s just another example of Donald Trump not showing up for everyday Americans, not delivering on results, making it very hard for governors like me who want to deliver for our residents, who want to grow the economy, who want to grow wealth, who want to build housing. Who want to lower costs; he’s running headlong in the opposite direction. And I don’t know if it’s, I don’t know what to attribute it to, but we just see it in sector after sector, realm after realm. But again, I’m proud of our colleges and universities. You know, people have got to understand the research that was done at colleges and universities a decade ago, two decades ago, three decades ago. It’s changed the world. You know, it’s why we have the lifesaving cures that we have today and the treatments. It’s why we have the cybersecurity and technologies for military capability that we have today. You cannot shut this off. And that’s what Donald Trump is doing by attacking our universities.
00:39:48
Yeah, Governor, to that point, it’s been really good reporting in recent days about research to places that Harvard, MIT and the like do, how that spills over into the economy there in greater Boston throughout the state. But you mentioned tariffs. Let’s dive in a little more on them. Also, for some of the small businesses in your state, what sort of impact are you seeing now and could be seeing in a much more dramatic fashion with the. China, the China tariffs in place and potentially the pause going away if deals can’t be struck with other trading nations as well.
00:40:20
Yeah, well, I’ve been convening with a lot of businesses, large, small, medium-size and almost universally, the reaction is negative. It’s hurting all of them. There are a few exceptions here and there. But, you know, the other day I was with a woman from Western Mass who runs a manufacturing outfit, and she’s had orders just completely stopped. So she said she describes herself as having a whiteboard that’s usually full up with orders and business. Right now, it is just a white board, okay? And that means she’s had to lay off employees, which, you know, has an impact on the broader economy. That’s the reality. The other thing I see is there’s no capital being deployed in America right now. Companies are, understandably, with the uncertainty of this market and the roller coaster that he has us on, the whiplash, you know? I’m going to fire Jerome Powell. I’m not going to fire Jerome Powell. You know, I’m imposing tariffs. I’m backing off. That creates so much uncertainty for the market, for business, for investment. And that plays out real time in our states where, you know, companies aren’t putting those orders in. As a result, our manufacturers and other smaller businesses are not getting the business that they’re used to getting. And when they’re not getting the business, they’re having to lay off folks. That’s that’s that’s why this has got to stop. You know, he’s got to stop.
00:41:45
So the consequences, Governor Healey, of this presidency are so severe, so early. I think it’s worth talking about politics for a second. You talked about President Trump basically not showing up for the everyday American as he as he has promised to. I asked you about how Massachusetts is fighting back. But I’m curious how you think Democrats should put what is happening into words, especially when trying to talk to American voters who voted for Trump.
00:42:20
I think it’s a matter of communicating, continuing to communicate. Here’s the action he’s taken. Here’s the consequence. Many of us celebrated Easter this weekend. Eggs are still over $6 for a carton. There are stories of people buying potatoes and painting potatoes instead, right? I mean, here are the actions he’s taking, and here are the consequences. There’s a reason your dad, who’s a veteran, can’t get care right now at the VA. That’s because Donald Trump has cut VA funding, and as a result, doctors and staff have been fired. This is. I think the work that Democrats need to do and they need to stand up; they need to stand up for things like due process and the rule of law, which, you know, may not mean much to people. It’s hard sometimes to understand. But I think what people understand is the government in this country. And I’m in Massachusetts. We just celebrated 250 years the other day with a great Patriots Day celebration on the Green and Lexington and Concord. You know, I think what Americans understand is that the government isn’t allowed to come into your home at night and take you away without cause. The government can’t drive up behind you as you’re walking in on your way to work and take you away and put you in some prison somewhere. There are certain legal rights that this country was founded on that we need to respect. And I see some of the pushback coming in the lawsuits that have been filed. It’s very important. I want to give credit to my colleague, Janet Mills, the Governor of Maine, who got a very strong ruling just last week, you know, because once again, when Trump was taking away funding for school food, for food for kids in the state of Maine, you know, she got a ruling that said that’s illegal. He’s violating the law doing it. And I just think that we need to continue to push back while articulating to Americans. Here’s what Donald Trump is doing. And here’s why your 401(k) is continuing to go down.
00:44:19
It’s great to have these governors on, especially you, Democratic Governor Maura Healey of Massachusetts. Thank you very much. And we recently had Janet Mills on, and she was fantastic, facing an onslaught of pressure from the Trump administration.
00:44:34
Coming up on Good to See You.
Alright, I need to summarize the provided transcript into three FAQs. Let me start by reading through the entire text to understand the key points.
First, the main topics discussed are the U.S.-China trade war, President Trump’s comments on Federal Reserve Chair Jerome Powell, and the potential economic impacts of tariffs, including warnings from major retailers about price increases and empty shelves. There’s also mention of international reactions, such as the IMF’s growth forecast cut, and political responses from figures like Governor Maura Healey.
For the first FAQ, the trade war and its implications seem central. The transcript mentions Treasury Secretary Scott Besson’s closed-door meeting, Trump’s comments on tariffs, and the White House’s stance. The market reactions and warnings from Walmart and other retailers about the consequences of tariffs are significant. The IMF’s reduced growth forecast and China’s response also tie into this.
The second FAQ should focus on Trump’s stance towards Jerome Powell. The transcript details Trump’s conflicting statements about wanting to fire Powell, then walking it back, and the market’s reaction to this uncertainty. The broader concern here is the independence of the Federal Reserve and how political interference might affect economic stability.
The third FAQ needs to address the domestic economic concerns. Retailers like Walmart and Home Depot warning about imminent price hikes and empty shelves within two weeks is a key point. The impact on small businesses, layoffs, and the disruption in supply chains are all part of this. Additionally, Governor Healey’s comments on the negative effects of Trump’s policies on education, healthcare, and research, leading to a brain drain to China, add depth to this issue.
I should ensure each FAQ question is clear and the answers synthesize the relevant parts of the transcript without adding external information. Also, using the exact quotes and specific details from the text will make the FAQs accurate and informative.
Frequently Asked Questions (FAQs)
1. What are the current developments in the U.S.-China trade war, and how are markets reacting?
The U.S. Treasury Secretary, Scott Besson, stated in a closed-door meeting that President Trump’s trade war with China is “not sustainable” and expects a de-escalation soon, though negotiations remain challenging. Despite optimism from the White House about potential deals, no formal talks with China have begun. Markets reacted to these signals with volatility, including a 2% pre-market surge in S&P and Nasdaq futures. However, China warned that U.S. pressure could hinder progress. The IMF also slashed its 2025 U.S. growth forecast to 1.8%, citing tariff-related uncertainties. Retail giants like Walmart and Home Depot warned Trump that tariffs could lead to empty shelves and price hikes within two weeks, escalating concerns about economic fallout.
2. What is President Trump’s stance on Federal Reserve Chair Jerome Powell?
Trump recently walked back his attacks on Powell, claiming he “never intended to fire him” despite earlier social media posts calling Powell’s termination urgent. Trump criticized Powell for not lowering interest rates, calling it a “perfect time” to do so. This reversal followed market turmoil triggered by Trump’s threats, with investors fearing political interference in the Fed’s independence. Analysts noted Trump’s pattern of vacillating rhetoric, influenced by warnings from CEOs and advisors about market instability. The episode highlighted broader concerns about White House credibility and the Fed’s operational independence.
3. What are the domestic economic concerns linked to Trump’s trade and tariff policies?
Major U.S. retailers, including Walmart and Target, privately warned Trump that tariffs could disrupt supply chains, raise prices, and result in empty shelves within two weeks. Small businesses face layoffs and order cancellations due to uncertainty, while manufacturers struggle with rising costs for materials like Canadian lumber and Mexican gypsum. Governor Maura Healey (D-MA) highlighted collateral damage to universities and research institutions, citing layoffs of scientists and halted clinical trials due to funding cuts. She warned of a “brain drain” to China and criticized Trump’s policies for undermining U.S. competitiveness. The combined effects threaten consumer prices, employment, and long-term economic growth.
